Maintaining your business’ social media presence is incredibly important. You need to respond to people talking about your brand and understand how people view your company.
In the latest episode of the Marketing Strategy Show I was joined by Anna Kotchetkova of Good Social Only to discuss Making the most of Social Media.
Topics covered were;
- Why Monitoring Matters
- Who Should Monitor
- Listening and Responding
- Setting Goals
- Where to monitor on different social media platforms
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If you want more information from this episode check out the transcript below.
Speaker 1: Welcome to Marketing Show, the 20 to 30 minutes of marketing magic that will help you connect the dots with all the digital, social, and old school marketing and sales options available today. Our aim is to give you practical, effective tips and ideas so your business or professional practise can get more prospects, and nurture those prospects to becoming long-term customers. This show is sponsored but The Marketing Strategy Company, who help B2B organisations develop winning marketing strategies and [00:00:30] sales and marketing automation systems to turn their sales and marketing efforts into new customers and dollars through their marketing. Check out The Marketing Strategy Company’s planning and marketing services at TheMarketingStrategy.co. That’s TheMarketingStrategy.co.
Kym Hefferman:Hi, and welcome to today’s episode of The Marketing Strategy Show. The Marketing Strategy Show is all about getting the right marketing for your business. In our marketing strategy episodes, we pull back the curtain with experts on a specialised topic, [00:01:00] and today is no different. Now a lot of our episodes to date, we’ve covered lots of topics, including sales, ideal customers, or buyer percentages, Facebook ads, LinkedIn, branding, video marketing, and marketing sales activities that boost the value as well as the revenue of your business. But today we’re going to go back to basics and talk about strategy, social media strategy in particular.
Now we all know, and you’ve heard me bang on before about how important it is before you dive into any marketing activity, [00:01:30] you get the strategy sorted, and social media is no exception. So today I’ve invited Anna Kochetkova from Good Social Only to talk through what to consider and how to go about putting your social media strategy together. Get ready for some great social media strategy jewels.
Hey, Anna. Are you there?
Anna Kochetkova Hi, there. How are you?
Kym Hefferman: Good. I’m really well, thank you, and thanks very much for joining us. I’m really keen to talk to you about this topic on social media strategy, because you and I have chatted before [00:02:00] the show and lots of times about people just jumping into social media without any real strategy because they have to be on Facebook, or have to be on LinkedIn. It’s almost like you have to do it these days, and that’s what everyone tells you, but maybe before we jump into that, why don’t we have a bit of the Anna story.
Anna Kochetkova: That sounds good. I’m so excited to be here. Thank you so much for having me. I think this conversation is just so important, and I am a proud, obvious, because [00:02:30] I’m really passionate about it. I really want to help people, and I want to help business owners to make their life a lot easier, and to give them the tools that they need to grow their business.
My background is actually journalism. I’ve got two master’s degrees in journalism and a degree in business, and I worked in [SEO 00:02:50] initially operating digital marketing, social media with so many different brands, and I finally arrived to where I am today, and I’ve been running [00:03:00] this business for about four years now creating the strategy because I’ve noticed that was the element, and it’s kind of funny to say that, but that core element was missing in so many different places. Everyone was posting a lot. [inaudible 00:03:14] ads where [inaudible 00:03:17], but they’d forgot why they were doing this. So going back to those basics was just not there, and I felt like I can do it. I can try to help with that and I’m going to pull everyone I can pull back to basics to really help them grow.
Kym Hefferman: Yeah it looks fantastic. I was listening to [00:03:30] another digital marketing podcast yesterday, and it was really interesting. They were talking about so many people they come across as an agency that say, “oh, Facebook. Haven’t posted. I better post something. What do I post? I’m not sure.” And they just post anything up there.
Anna Kochetkova: Yeah, it’s like posting for the sake of posting, right?
Kym Hefferman: Yeah, exactly. People are flooded with content, right, and if it hasn’t got any [00:04:00] strategic element about what you want to achieve, you might as well go on and put litter box drops out. It’s the same thing really, isn’t it, with no strategy behind it.
Anna Kochetkova: Yes, exactly, and I think that’s why there are dates and different algorithms for different channels bringing it back to everyone because they didn’t have the strategy on how to deal with that and they didn’t have a strategy initially, so that posting was for the sake of posting. And so once that was stopped or prevented by Facebook, for example, it became a lot more challenging. It became [00:04:30] a problem.
Kym Hefferman: Why don’t we just talk about that. And this is being recorded in May 2018, so people listening to it in a year or so, I don’t think it will be any different. But, gradually, most free media, whether it be Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, LinkedIn, etc, there’s no sort of thing as free media. Ultimately, over time, they will find a way to monetize the channel. So you’ve really got to be thinking about how you use social media as one of your platforms [00:05:00] for communicating, haven’t you?
Anna Kochetkova: Yes, absolutely. Kym, you’re so right. And, actually saying that the media is free is also a little bit challenging and a little bit deceitful. Only because you’re still putting time into doing that, but we sometimes not putting direct online, as you say, it could become monetized.
Kym Hefferman: That’s a really interesting point you make. I think a lot of business owners and managers think it’s all about the money you put into the paid channel, but if you [00:05:30] start spending three, four, ten hours a week posting on whatever social media channel without a return or a strategy, that is real dollars. It’s not just time. It’s real dollars.
Anna Kochetkova: Absolutely. I actually look at that as what would you pay yourself per hour to do that? So if you have to spend time researching for content, looking what others do, then creating and coming out with messaging and posting it and doing it, more or less, randomly, how much would you pay yourself per hour and calculate how many hours you’ve done. That’s the money is still invested, right?
Kym Hefferman: [00:06:00] I love that idea. That’s a really good way to evaluate what you and I have talked about a few times. Should you actually be doing it? So if you’re spending ten hours a week creating the content, doing the post, responding to people, and you calculate your rate of, let’s say 50 dollars an hour to make it easy, that’s 500 dollars a week, or 2000 dollars a month.
Anna Kochetkova: Absolutely.
Kym Hefferman: And you could be spending that time selling or in front of customers.
Anna Kochetkova: [00:06:30] Exactly. Yes, I think that’s the beauty of strategy and the importance of it is figuring out where you’re putting resources and not specifically about posting. [inaudible 00:06:40] and how many times I buy based on social media, what happens as well, because sometimes you might spend resources somewhere else more effectively.
Kym Hefferman: Yeah. I love that idea. So let’s talk a little bit about different channels and what the channels offer. They [00:07:00] question I ask you, and I think you’ll say well it depends, today, what are the major channels have for social media that you see. Not that you should be on all of them. We’ve got Facebook, for starters. That’s the big one, isn’t it?
Anna Kochetkova: Yes. I think Facebook is very popular and Facebook is really big and then we have Instagram which is owned by Facebook. And there’s Twitter. It’s very big as well. There are a few smaller channels that are very specific to a particular area. Certain channels just for travel. [inaudible 00:07:29] is still quite big for photographers. [00:07:30] So some of the stuff is even categorised. [inaudible 00:07:36]. Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, LinkedIn, they are quite large and very big at the moment, yes.
Kym Hefferman: I guess the other question for you. What about other channels like Houzz and those sort of things, do you consider them social media, or more directories?
Anna Kochetkova: Interesting question, actually. [00:08:00] I think actually a lot more other sites are social media that we don’t think are social media. Anywhere where we have conversation and we can flood our content into, and where people connect with each other, and [inaudible 00:08:15], or read reviews is a social media channel, to be honest. Because it’s so similar in the way it begins.
Kym Hefferman: Yeah because I think a lot of people just think about. That’s a really important distinction. These people [00:08:30] are thinking about channels, there might be other things. Like Trip Advisor for travel, obviously, or food directories, there’s a whole variety of channels, isn’t there, that you should look at. So let’s start with where do you start with strategy then? And I want your first step.
Anna Kochetkova: My first step with starting to open with strategy is actually understanding where business is at. I like to really dig into it and understand how long the business has been running for and what’s their budget so far. Everything has [00:09:00] some data. It’s quite challenging because many businesses are not keeping their data very well. They don’t have any data at this point because they’re not sure where to be collect it. I want to go through and audit, and it’s a business audit, it’s not a social media audit. By now the business has been running for some time, they have business report results, and they’ve already collected some sales from social media. This is a perfect place to start. Jumping into it, they’d really need to value there resources as well, and look and see what they have. Then they run with [00:09:30] that channel. Which channel is the best for them and find the grounds and find the [inaudible 00:09:40].
Kym Hefferman: Okay. Let’s go back to that first one then. I’ll try to pull this apart. When you say, what are their goals, what specifically could be some of the goals? Would they be things like getting leads or getting web site visits? What are some of the goals that people need [00:10:00] to think about?
Anna Kochetkova: Awesome question. That’s actually it’s very interesting. When there’s site goals and people all of the time say, “look, I want our business to grow. I want sales.” We sometimes forget about little goals along the way to get them there. Because it really depends on where they are in business as well. So that’s a perfect question. Sometimes that might be the very start. They want to get first five leads in this month because that will take them somewhere else in their business, say hiring someone. [00:10:30] Getting more resources, getting assistants, [inaudible 00:10:33]. That might be the first step that the social media can help with. If they have a goal of, yes I want more sales, I want more precise. So five sales. There’s something there because then I will be able to afford this, this, and that and then we will move onto the next one. Another one falls into starting to use Facebook for the first time ever and saying, “okay, tomorrow we’ll [inaudible 00:10:57] again.”
Kym Hefferman: [00:11:00] I guess that’s a really important distinction you made, a lot of the distinctions. It’s not just about getting more sales. Be specific about how many more leads or whatever, and also, within what time frame. I picked up that you said five within the next month throughout. You think it’s important not to just have a quantity, but also to have a target of time when you want to retrieve that goal.
Anna Kochetkova: I think that’s important to have that recorded and hold yourself accountable and come back through to it and go, yep, that worked for me or, you know what, I run it and tested it. This is not my [inaudible 00:11:32] I should go somewhere else.
Kym Hefferman: The second thing you mentioned was what you like to [00:11:30] do when you first meet with someone is see how they’re performing. You said most of them don’t seem to be measuring. What should they be measuring and how should they measure that?
Anna Kochetkova: That’s a very good question. It’s actually been quite challenging for part of the people because data is such a [00:12:00] big area. And also about stuff about big data and it’s just too overwhelming. When I first meet, and this is on [inaudible 00:12:07], I usually look into how many years they’ve been in the business and what’s changed over this period of time. If they’re fairly new, but they’ve started to see one or two ratings, I’d love to see how they got there. If social media was involved, how they got the first leads, what works for them, what didn’t work for them, what kind of advertising they ran, what kind of post they ran, [00:12:30] which channels they used, and if they were able to track specific sales from that activity that they had. A lot of times it’s not there.
Kym Hefferman: So you’re not just looking at the social media then, you’re looking at. And it’s a really good point. I see that a lot too in most companies. And it’s not easy, is it, to measure where your new business comes from. Is it coming from online ads, from web site inquiries, from referrals, from social media. [00:13:00] You look at what channels people get their inquiries from, is that right?
Anna Kochetkova: Yes, that’s correct. And I’d love to also see what other channels, outside of digital, what else they’ve done. Maybe they already had leads, maybe they were in a corporate job and then they moved on. They had a lot of people who followed them. And how they communicated with them would be actually really helpful. To find out the messages that they’ve used to connect with those leads. It’s almost like their mission and what [00:13:30] was their offer and then you just start pulling apart everything, trying to figure out what brought those leads.
Kym Hefferman: How do most of the people measure that? Is it done by a spreadsheet, you ask people how they found you? What have you found is the best way to do that.
Anna Kochetkova: Yeah, spreadsheets is actually that common, and if your business scale is normal, I think that’s a good start. I really want to see [inaudible 00:13:55]. I’ve noticed some people use Trello, which is an application can be on phone or you can use on [00:14:00] a desktop. They really truly track their leads, especially for service businesses. It’s really helpful because then you can have the names there or their sales goals in there and they come back every week and just track who they talked to, what they got out of it, or which even post on Facebook brought them sales.
Kym Hefferman: One of the chances, of course is that people might see a post on social media, they might visit your web site and then call you. So where is that [00:14:30] lead actually coming from. For the phone call, from the web site visit, which may be another result from the social media which may be anonymous as well.
Anna Kochetkova: Absolutely, that’s why it’s so important to actually track those little things as well. And also, very important what kind of messaging worked for what channel. So we had a conversation with a friend, and a friend referred them to someone else. What did they tell this friend. Who was that person they referred them to? What did you talk about? [00:15:00] What you got out of it? You could have gone to a place of work, for example, and posted something.
PART 1 OF 3 ENDS [00:15:04]
Anna Kochetkova: What you got out of it, same with you could’ve gone some place with work, for example, and posted something that really resonated with people at your work.
Kym Hefferman: Yeah.
Anna Kochetkova: Make a record of that happening, so later you can come back and say, ‘Oh my God, those messages work, this one didn’t work.’ It will become so incredibly clearer.
Kym Hefferman: And with, that’s a really important point. So let’s take Facebook for example, because it’s probably one of the easiest ones to measure. You really should be looking at the engagement of each of your posts, is that what you’re saying?
Anna Kochetkova: That’s actually interesting. This [00:15:30] is already breaking down the analytics, if you’re running the campaign on Facebook, whether that’s price or advertising, the engagement is incredibly important, and I also would consider engagement rates a lot. Just the difference between all the likes and clicks, and your reach. Because you can have really, really big reach on your posts, but seeing nothing engaged with that. Or you can have a very low reach, like, on average less people, but say you got leads out of it.
Kym Hefferman: Yeah.
Anna Kochetkova: It’s important [00:16:00] to understand where your range between the two. I think, also, looking to engagement, deciding whether that’s important for business or not is a part of strategy. It’s just trying to understand whether that’s what you’re looking for, so that is your first step of your campaign.
Kym Hefferman: Okay. So, not necessarily engagement, because the other thing I thought maybe you could come up with, I’m sure you’ve heard of this as well, it’s lovely to have a thousand or two thousand followers on Instagram or Facebook or [00:16:30] LinkedIn or whatever, but who cares if none of them are actually reading it or engaging with it, right?
Anna Kochetkova: Yes, yes. And to add to that, it’s also why would you have two thousand people and say don’t take any action? It might be a bit of one step of their strategy, for example, because you’re one click away.
Kym Hefferman: Yeah.
Anna Kochetkova: It’s just, you know, a very common understanding that that’s what you are doing, because you see the goal becomes more followers and you have a number that you have aspired to without understanding why you are doing that. It’s just on the page. It’s just not really generating much for the business.
Kym Hefferman: Okay, [00:17:00] so let’s talk about Facebook. We’ll stick with Facebook for a minute. So, do you suggest it’s worthwhile people are boosting posts?
Anna Kochetkova: I think boosting posts should only be done if it’s a strategic choice to do that.
Kym Hefferman: Right.
Anna Kochetkova: There’s a difference between boosting posts and blanket advertising and it’s quite interesting. Boost is right there, on the page, [00:17:30] just under the post. So, people find it very easy to actually find it and try it and I’ve talked to so many businesses where they actually told me: “But it’s right there! Why shouldn’t I be doing it? I mean, It’s right there so I can go, I can boost this and get things happening straight away.” But their disappointment was that they never got anything out of it because they didn’t have clarity, that clarity that they needed to know what they were doing. But, the biggest difference between boosts and advertising, and I think this is where the challenge comes in, as well, once you go an [00:18:00] boosting, you are asking for an engagement and Facebook is going around and looking for people who will engage with the post, which is like posting on the internet, which channel, which who is just seeing it. But it wouldn’t reach the people who would do some sort of action. Clicking and downloading something or any of that sort of stuff.
Kym Hefferman: Okay. So, I guess that’s a really good point. I’ve had a number of people in different times say to me, well, it only cost me 20 bucks and I reached another [00:18:30] 5,000 people. Well, I might as well put it in a poker machine, I might end up with a thousand dollars, right?
Anna Kochetkova: Exactly, exactly.
Kym Hefferman: It’s really gambling.
Anna Kochetkova: It is a bit. And if the goal was to reach people, why not? But, you just understand why you’re doing that. Balance? No.
Kym Hefferman: So, really then, boosting you would say, is good if you want to reach more people and just for brand awareness sake, it’s worthwhile. In fact, it’s probably better.
Anna Kochetkova: You’re not wrong. If that’s part of your [00:19:00] strategy, absolutely. I would say that, for example, about if I write a blog.
Kym Hefferman: Yeah.
Anna Kochetkova: And it was saying about something very controversial about Facebook or social media altogether and then I posted it on my page. I would consider boosting it to get more eyes on it because I think the topic by itself and message by itself might generate engagement in the Facebook [inaudible 00:19:20]
Kym Hefferman: Yeah.
Anna Kochetkova: But if you are looking to converge in some way or let people perform some sort of action or do something, [00:19:30] then boosting would be just really the wrong choice.
Kym Hefferman: I guess these days, with Facebook, showing this and this post organically, it’s down so low, it’s barely negligible, if you do want your posts to be seen by all your followers and more people, you really should be paying to boost it.
Anna Kochetkova: This is actually tricky. It is a bit annoying, but you need to have the following and then you need to boost your content to the followers. You already have your following, you shouldn’t be doing that. It is [00:20:00] a very tricky grey area now. And it just is for a few people and I think for the right reason. If you have the following, I used to think about it as a database.
Kym Hefferman: Yeah.
Anna Kochetkova: So, you have some likes on Facebook and there are people that will follow along because they actually like what you are producing. That’s your database. You can now talk to them and talk back, hopefully, and you get some reaction, sales. That’s wonderful. But now with that reach, we don’t have that, so now we’ve paid for [inaudible 00:20:24], so we have the likes. But now we have to boost your posts so the most likes can see it. [00:20:30] For that reason, I just don’t like that approach at all anymore. It’s just really not good practise. I rather would consider advertising.
Kym Hefferman: Why, because it’s much more targeted.
Anna Kochetkova: Yes. And advertising gives you three more objectives. So now it’s not about getting engagements or boosting the post, not worrying what we are going to get from it. It’s the same typical objectives that you can choose, which are actually quite different from what business objectives are. But at least you the choice of, okay so, now I want to get people who wants [00:21:00] to sign up for my blog. I have a very specific type of ad that can run to achieve that.
Kym Hefferman: Okay. So that’s fine, but let’s talk Instagram [inaudible 00:21:10] So, let’s talk about Instagram and posting on Instagram, versus, you know, boosting on Instagram. So, when should you be on Instagram? What’s the business or what sort of objective should you have to be on Instagram?
Anna Kochetkova: I feel like Instagram is still in such an early stage of it’s [00:21:30] life, I guess. Since Facebook purchased Instagram, there’s been improvement. They’ve been actually working on it and they have been creating more pictures. But I feel like they haven’t completed it, and it’s not quite there. You can’t sell through Instagram. You can now take some of your products and you can retail. It’s just such a difficult channel when it comes to R.O.A. It’s one of the most difficult ones to try and track it. Try and convert people.
It is a visual platform [00:22:00] and I think that’s where it gets a bit tricky for some reasons, because they feel like they’re product is going to be visual, so it should be on a visual channel. What I’m trying to think about it from the behaviour point of view. People come to Instagram to feel better. To scroll through your friends or look through fashion items or some [inaudible 00:22:23] They are doing that, great. But it doesn’t mean they are purchasing anything. And I’m not even quite sure that works in terms of establishing leadership. [00:22:30] The channel is so much about core groups, rather than establishing the leadership, and having more leads and having more sales. It’s just very tricky, I find.
Kym Hefferman: I guess you also gotta think about, like any channel, it’s not going to be only once every two months, is there? The challenge with Instagram, particularly if you’re selling business to businesses, what do you have that is visually strong to post one or twice a week?
Anna Kochetkova: [00:23:00] Absolutely. Finding … Timing is such a discussion for everyone at the moment. You do need to be active enough on Instagram as well as Facebook or any channels that you decide to go with. But it has to be a part of a strategy. There’s no really one blueprint that tells you come here and post everyday. This something to test, this is something to grade and it will be based on who’s using that channel. It’s your following that is on that channel and are they active? [00:23:30] Are they buying from this channel? Are you[inaudible 00:23:32] with them? Do you have conversations with them? Then that’s data will direct you and tell you how many times you need to post. This is why I don’t think there’s a good that’s a good place, and I don’t think there’s one set rule how to do it.
Kym Hefferman: Tell me about Twitter, then. I mean, my impression maybe I’m wrong with twitter, is it’s fantastic if you want to connect to journalists and maybe IT people. But, beyond that, for most businesses, it does not have much value, but maybe I’m wrong [00:24:00] with that. Have you had some success with Twitter?
Anna Kochetkova: Actually, yes. Twitter has been really kind to me and to some of my clients and then actually was always dependent and actually has been most dependent on their following. It’s always the same situation, whether with people, which are your target market are on that channel or not.
Kym Hefferman: Right
Anna Kochetkova: So, those where we thought wasn’t, and who are actually not there, almost nothing came out of it. [inaudible 00:24:31] [00:24:30] as well. But I have a few clients with really strong and loyal following and no matter which channel I would demonstrate, they were to cushion, and it was fantastic. Personally, I just use it for news.
Kym Hefferman: Yeah, yeah. It’s also I think, Twitter’s a great source to me for yeah, what’s happening and what’s trending. Right? So I think it’s a great source for what your content creation should be in some ways, because you can see what’s trending. Maybe not the greatest source for publishing your content, necessarily, unless you are a thought leader of some [00:25:00] sort.
Anna Kochetkova: I see more of a news channels when it comes to trending because they it is based on what is popular at the moment and let’s say something was on the news, it correlates with most hits. If something is on the news, and people are talking about it on twitter, while they’re seeing it [inaudible 00:25:16] which you used, for example, and if you get enough people doing that, it starts to trend. So, we would really look into that for inspiration, but I would look whether that target demographic is there. That’s when we can see it.
Kym Hefferman: Right. Or [00:25:30] if you have something newsworthy to share or some comment on a current topic that’s in your area.
Anna Kochetkova: Possible, but you need to make sure they are listening. Because is there is no one there in your demographic-
Kym Hefferman: Right.
Anna Kochetkova: [inaudible 00:25:43]your demographic that you wanna talk to, they won’t see it.
Kym Hefferman: And how do you go about finding out if they are on there? Is that a matter of testing? Do you suggest people go out and ask [00:26:00] their audience by questionnaire? What’s the best way for people to try and establish that?
Anna Kochetkova: Yes, I’d say testing and that’s why everything I was talking about having the data [inaudible 00:26:11] for the first time. This is where we spend some time together, figuring out what data they already have. Sometimes they have data because if they’ve been on social for so many years, but they’ve never really looked into it.
Kym Hefferman: Yeah.
Anna Kochetkova: And they didn’t realise they had that following. I would be able to go and find it, and research it and figure out. [00:26:30] And when you start from scratch or it’s just really small, testing. Definitely testing. Decide on a strategy. Decide on your themes on the content. One that [inaudible 00:26:40]at a time and come back and see the results and we’ll now hash them out and have a benchmark.
Kym Hefferman: Right. Okay. So, lets say you did that. And talk to me about LinkedIn then. LinkedIn is a funny beast. It sort of, to me, seems a little bit outside social media. It’s a lead generation research tool to find prospects. [00:27:00] It’s also a recruitment tool. Some call it a content a publishing tool. But I think there is much less engagement of content on LinkedIn, I find. Unless you are specifically in that[inaudible 00:27:11]environment. What’s your thought on that?
Anna Kochetkova: LinkedIn is a unique beast, that’s for sure. I Don’t see it … It really stands alone and it’s very different because of how segregated it is. It’s just a professional network and people have slightly different intentions. It has been a little bit … [00:27:30] It starting to shift almost to becoming Facebook only because people started to sell, sorry to send too many sales messages to each other and they had some content issues [inaudible 00:27:41] where I wouldn’t be able to judge that at all. But it is just such a difference intention for this network and I think it would definitely work for particular industries. I don’t think everyone should be jumping on it.[inaudible 00:27:52] decide to switch careers, for example. But I think it’s very niched. [inaudible 00:27:58]only particular areas should really invest [00:28:00] into it, but on top of that, I must say it’s another source. And it’s another attention and it’s another channel. Sometimes it’s best to [inaudible 00:28:09] and grow that way and some times its best to go, “Yeah that’s my resource, and that’s what I’m going to go to.”
Kym Hefferman: I think it can work very successfully for lot of people, but I guess it’s like all channels, email, social media, even, you know, traditional outbound calling, not everyone is going to respond because not everyone is on there [00:28:30] actively using the channel. Same with Facebook. Not everyone is actively on Facebook, I guess. But, like everything else, you say you need to measure it and work out what your process beyond the social media channel, as well. So it’s great that people are engaged and are inquiring, but what’s your sales process or your nurturing process beyond that.
Anna Kochetkova: Absolutely, yes. Including messaging. We run so many ads sometimes, or have some sales requests, but we forget to really dive into that message in your sales process [00:29:00] maybe, or nurturing. So what this message is about and who is it reaching, because once you know your target market very intimately, very well, you need to know what you are going to tell them because if you’re reaching them with your ads, but you’re telling them something that doesn’t resonate with them, that’s also wasting resources.
Kym Hefferman: And what are some of the other channels that your clients or people you come across say having some success with these days? And things like, I’ve heard people talk about, you know, Snapchat, Pinterest, [00:29:30] a whole variety of different channels.
Anna Kochetkova: Yes.
Kym Hefferman: And even messenger, these days from the Facebook ad viewpoint, I guess, as well.
Anna Kochetkova: Yeah, messenger is becoming really big and Chatbox is another really interesting area. I think it’s actually pretty exciting. I think Chatbox would be really helpful for someone who [inaudible 00:29:49] some businesses when you set up your regeneration, maybe a sales final, and Chatbox is really coming into that, as well. Just don’t jump into it without really [inaudible 00:30:00] I think that’s [00:30:00] a cool area to look into.
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Anna Kochetkova: I think that’s a really cool area to look into. Insurance is just really weak in Australia.
Kym Hefferman: Right.
Anna Kochetkova: It’s working a little bit better overseas because they’ve got more features, which is quite interesting that we still have a border when it comes to digital, even though that’s all online.
And Snapchat is again … going back to that demographics, it’s your type of market, on Snapchat. And for me and for many of my clients that is trying [inaudible 00:30:30] so that’s why we don’t look into it [00:30:30] too much at all.
Kym Hefferman: So really I guess it comes back to, again the time and effort which is our very first question, right? How much time do you have to spend on social media.
If you’ve got 10 or 15 hours a week in your own time or your staff’s time, I think I know what you’re going to recommend. Where would you recommend they start? LinkedIn, Facebook, Twitter?
Anna Kochetkova: I recommend that they definitely start from the strategy. From our getting [00:31:00] the resources and the times. So if they decided that that two staff, or one staff … they have 10 hours a week, they would set these steps. The roadmap.
And they would decide, “Okay, so we’re going run that campaign. Because we’re trying to get those five clients for our first month of work. Then we’re going to put them in this folder. Or in this [inaudible 00:31:24] and you’re going to nurture them this way.”
And you’re just going to continue to really the process. But setting up [00:31:30] that roadmap, and then selling the [inaudible 00:31:33] I think is where the gold is.
Kym Hefferman: And I guess part of that roadmap is, that first step is … we spoke a little about this at the beginning. About working out what the content is for those people.
And the way I recommend, and you may have a similar method, is to just sit down and work out what are the questions people are asking you all the time. And that’s the content you should be writing about.
I guess it’s no different on social.
Anna Kochetkova: That’s a very good point. Sometimes I would go [00:32:00] to groups, for example, let them in to what I do, and I would actually ask questions about social media. Trying to understand more struggles, and pains, and challenges people go through.
And the collection of those questions that people ask me give me everything I need. It’s all the content I would be talking about. I don’t need to guess. I don’t need to [crosstalk 00:32:18] to too many things. I just go with what they need.
Kym Hefferman: Yes and I think that forums is another great source for that isn’t it? But I think all of that is just going with a list of questions. But then you need a content plan, don’t you?
Anna Kochetkova: Yes that’s actually a good point. I love too … well I’m a bit of a organising freak [inaudible 00:32:31] thing I guess, everything with me. Super organised. But I like to [inaudible 00:32:31] things. [00:32:30] And once you’ve decided that, “Okay this is going to pinpoints to my target audience,” you can spread it into several things.
You can be talking about their pain, or Mondays. You can be talking about leadership and [inaudible 00:32:51] space. And Wednesdays. And then you can be asking them questions about what they’ve gone through [inaudible 00:33:01].
Kym Hefferman: Right okay you’ve basically [00:33:00] got a content plan then. How far out would you normally recommend that content plan goes? One, two, three months?
Anna Kochetkova: I’d go a month. I like to run it for a month. To go back, and then see the results and see if I need to tweak it. A month is really good.
Kym Hefferman: So it’s a rolling month. You’ve got it planned out one month in advance, basically.
Anna Kochetkova: Yes. Absolutely in advance, yes. And sometimes there’s an opportunity to deter, it would be good. [00:33:30] But I don’t know, most of my clients are quite dynamic. So that’s not really an option.
You need to go back to all the data for every month, and pretty much every month we will change something. So four weeks is a good time.
Kym Hefferman: What about in terms of the content you post on Facebook? Links back to your website, or no links back to your website?
Anna Kochetkova: Definitely depend on the strategy, and then on content themes. Depending on what you want to get out of that particular post, I don’t have much linked [00:34:00] or bring other clients. Unless there is something specific.
So one of our clients is running a very big event, very soon. But the entire following has been waiting for it for a very long time. They’ve been really … they know them. They know what it’s about, they really want to go.
So the second post would probably have a link, but if I want to have that engagement, and just want to reinforce that I’m there and continue having conversations with them, I wouldn’t have it. Links sometimes can [inaudible 00:34:27] exhausting.
So there should be a very good [00:34:30] intention behind it. I would rather use links in advertising, and [crosstalk 00:34:35] in content. But it has to be tied back into the strategy, has to justify it.
Kym Hefferman: That’s an interesting point you raise there. If you’re running ads, should you have some content posted as well? Because when you’re running an ad, people will very often go back and check out your Facebook page, for example.
And if there’s nothing there for six months, does that look bad, or is that sort of irrelevant these days?
Anna Kochetkova: That’s interesting. [00:35:00] I’m thinking about it in the way of how would I use this, for example. And [inaudible 00:35:07] I guess. I don’t want people to post for the sake of posting, of course. I’m really worn down to [inaudible 00:35:15] value.
And if you’re sharing something on your page that is value to your potential customers, please do. And I think they definitely should be there. And [00:35:30] that would be my best to gauge whether should it be there, or not at all. Given the reach problems that we have had with Facebook.
Use value. That’s what they want. I think should definitely be there. But otherwise, no. Otherwise it wouldn’t be too much of … [inaudible 00:35:44], what I’m trying to say. And advertising will lead somewhere where you want people to go, instead.
And then they [00:36:00] would have to go an check out your page. But I must say, it does look odd sometimes. But it’s not even that their last content was where I [inaudible 00:36:01], but sometimes it’s the graphics, and the messaging.
That’s what puts me off a lot of the times. When people say that … maybe their business is luxurious, but maybe their content is not. And so it feels like it’s not aligned.
Kym Hefferman: Actually that’s a really good point. Part of the strategy … same with any marketing strategy, it’s not just about which channels, what your goals are, how often you’re going to post. It should actually be about what type of visuals, and what sort of tone you have, right?
Anna Kochetkova: [00:36:30] Yes, and it would be a part of planning of course. But all those little elements, they would be a part of your values. And so business is stands for something.
And they would … we all want to change the world in some way. We’re trying to bring something different. Something new. Resolve someone’s problems. And our business is usually solutions to someones problem. That’s why we exist. Because the service then and there, we’re the solution to something that is really, really wrong with them.
So that has to be [00:37:00] in all the messaging, and all the links, and all the looks, and all the feel. And I retired [inaudible 00:37:02] computer course, it’s almost like a charge you get at the very beginning.
But when I come to the page, and I see it and feel it and it talks to me, I don’t care about the content. About the post as a such anymore. Because it talks to me. It’s there, it’s really aligned with who I am. So I think that’s even more important.
Kym Hefferman: That’s a really interesting point that you raised. If you were a smaller business, is it better to be posting as yourself, or as the business page? [00:37:30] What’s your thoughts on that?
Anna Kochetkova: There’s an actual rule with Facebook. You cannot do any business activities, or business posting on a personal page. And I haven’t really heard anyone getting in too much trouble with that.
But to be honest with you, if you’ve only got a small business, and it’s just you, or even if it’s a larger corporation, it actually doesn’t mater. You stand for something, and your business has [inaudible 00:37:55]. Something you believe in. And it would be linked to your business because [00:38:00] that’s your baby.
And if you can post things around that, that’s not promoting your business, that’s promoting your values. It just happens to be aligned with your target market. Who then are coming to check out your business and buy from you.
So I think when you’re starting out, personal profile is actually a really good place to start, because it’s not limited. But you just have to take this traditional sales cap off, and not do the traditional sales. But [inaudible 00:38:26] your messaging, align with your values, and start asking questions.
Kym Hefferman: [00:38:30] And be obviously educational, adding of value. Rather than just promoting a product. Well you can’t promote a product, you said, on a personal page technically.
Anna Kochetkova: Technically you can’t. It’s against the rules. That’s why we came in and said, that I have beautiful shoes that I’m trying to sell. I might not actually not want to sell them. But same with giving away shoes. And buying things from my personal profile.
I’m a person, I’ve got shoes, a pair of shoes, I want to give it away. I’m going to put it on. It’s still going to breach it. So it’s a fairly grey area. But I know why they do [00:39:00] it [crosstalk 00:39:01].
Kym Hefferman: Depends on the size of the business, your objective, obviously like all the things we’ve spoken about.
So look, it’s been a really interesting conversation, sort of opened my eyes a lot in terms of the way I think social media. And strategy generally. So I really appreciate that. Is there anything you’d like to wrap up with?
A couple things that you want people to take away?
Anna Kochetkova: I want people to think more about their value, and more about admitting things that [inaudible 00:39:27]. There’s so many such amazing small [00:39:30] businesses, and they are saving people’s lives, solving peoples’ problems.
I think it’s fascinating the opportunity that we have, and I feel …. I think it’s so important to get their own, basic [inaudible 00:39:43]. To get their foundation right. Maybe, you know, getting their business page. Maybe their advice.
Just get this benchmark really well. Ask questions. Ask all the questions around. Talk to other people. And really study intimately your particular target market. Sometimes people are not even quite sure [00:40:00] about it. So ask some questions, and really figuring out what they want in this world.
It’s just amazing. And social will come in so easily, and marketing will just flow.
Kym Hefferman: I know you and I are members of a couple of groups, we share a common … in fact that’s how we first connected. By asking questions, and just watching what people are doing, and observing … listening, I guess, to what people are saying, right?
Anna Kochetkova: Yes, exactly. And they need so much, going back to the very basics of everything. Before we had this screen before our eyes. [00:40:30] We were asking these questions, we were handshaking, we were meeting people, we were there.
And it doesn’t have to be aggressive, and it doesn’t have to be scary. It’s a very personal connection with people. But once you have that sort of, and once that is really founded and grounded, the rest is just filling. And can [inaudible 00:40:51].
Kym Hefferman: I think it’s the old philosophy of know, like, and trust. So you’ve got to get to know someone, you’ve got to like what they do before you trust them to buy for them. That’s no different whether [00:41:00] you use social channels or other channels.
Anna Kochetkova: Yes, and I think that’s been forgotten. I think because of the screen that has been neglected. I really would like to mention that, because I would like people to remember that. I think about that again. It’s just that connection.
Kym Hefferman: And of course [inaudible 00:41:17] it’s been an absolute pleasure to have you onboard. Now if people want to connect with you, or learn more about how to put a social strategy together, what’s the best way for people to do that?
Anna Kochetkova: I am more than happy to connect personally on Facebook. You just have to look up [inaudible 00:41:30], [00:41:30] and oh my God, good luck.
Kym Hefferman: We’ll spell that out for people okay.
Anna Kochetkova: I was just going to say, there’s way too many [inaudible 00:41:42], so that might be challenging. Send an email through at [email protected] And they’re more than happy to say hi. And the Facebook page is of course GoodSocialOmni. That’s really easy to find.
But if you do manage to find [inaudible 00:42:00], please send messages, we’re more than happy [00:42:00] to chat. If there’s any challenges whatsoever … and I’m learning right now a lot more about what’s out there. What businesses are struggling with.
So I’d be honoured to find out more.
Kym Hefferman: Again it’s been absolutely wonderful having you on the broadcast. I really appreciate your time and I think there’s some real social media strategy jewels. As I said at the beginning I knew it would be.
That’s why I wanted to get you on the programmes today. And I’ll put all those links in the show next as well. [00:42:30] And so people can [crosstalk 00:42:31] together. And thank you again for your time, really appreciate it.
Anna Kochetkova: Thank you, that was my pleasure, it was fantastic, thanks so much.
Kym Hefferman: You have a great day. Bye bye.
Anna Kochetkova: Bye.
Speaker 1: Thanks for joining us on this episode of Marketing Show. We hope you got some practical, effective tips and ideas, so your organisation gets more prospects. And nurtures those prospects to becoming long-term customers.
Just a reminder, the show is sponsored by the Marketing Strategy Company, who help B2B organisations develop winning marketing strategies and sales in marketing automation [00:43:00] systems. To turn their sales and marketing efforts into new customers and dollars through their marketing.
Check out the show notes for this episode and the Marketing Strategy Company’s planning and marketing services at the marketingstrategy.co. That’s the marketingstrategy.co.
Until next time, happy marketing.
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